The SiteVisit

ICBA Generals 2024 E2 | Passion and Integrity in Construction Leadership with Ben Bakk, President at VPAC Construction Group

• Andrew Hansen, James Faulkner, Christian Hamm

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What if your family's legacy could be built brick by brick, with passion and integrity at its core? Join us as we chat with Ben Bakk, President of VPAC Construction Group, who takes us through his remarkable journey on entrepreneurship and running the business. Ben recounts his early days apprenticing with a high-end custom home builder in Whistler, the co-founding of VPAC, and the pivotal role his red seal journeyman carpenter certification played in gaining initial client trust. We explore the wide array of projects VPAC has undertaken, ranging from multifamily units to purpose-built rentals, and uncover Ben's unwavering dedication to both building and business.

Beyond the bricks and beams, we dissect the core elements underpinning VPAC's success—passion, energy, and unwavering ambition. Ben shares valuable insights on attracting and retaining top talent, the evolving marketing landscape within the construction industry, and the intrinsic value people derive from their work. We also touch on the significance of trust, integrity, and core values in leadership, alongside the balancing act of gut instincts and team autonomy. Wrapping up, Ben reflects on the importance of continuous progress and his aspirations for future generations to build on the solid foundation he's laid. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the makings of a successful family business and the principles that drive enduring success.

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Speaker 1:

Ben Bach. Am I pronouncing that right Bach?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, bach or Bach, it's actually Ben Bach.

Speaker 1:

Oh, bach, yeah, Bach, wow, of Hungarian, descent, hungarian. Yeah, good sausage there. Yeah, great sausage yeah.

Speaker 2:

Excellent, good call. Yeah, no, born and raised in North Van, but my dad and grandpa came over in the 50s North Van Yep, where'd you grow up?

Speaker 1:

in North Van Lynn Valley.

Speaker 2:

I grew up over there too.

Speaker 1:

Oh yeah, what high school I went to Sentinel.

Speaker 2:

Oh yeah, one of those guys.

Speaker 1:

No, no no, I was on the Glenmore side.

Speaker 2:

We were the Richie ones. That was the Chartwell people you're thinking about. Yeah, yeah, no, I'm kidding All good, one of those guys, you're one of the other guys.

Speaker 1:

All good man. Yeah, lynn Valley, sutherland. Welcome to the Site. Visit Podcast.

Speaker 2:

Leadership and perspective from construction with your host, james Faulkner, live off the show floor at ICBA's Meet the Generals 2024.

Speaker 1:

Well, that's cool. So VPAC. So you and your brother started this.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we'll call him my brother. He's actually my dad's half-brother. I grew up with him like a cousin, but technically, by lineage he's a half-uncle. We started the business in 2002, just as two guys that were building, and it evolved very quickly from that, started getting into business actually in 1996 after doing my apprenticeship in Whistler?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I saw that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so that was a fun journey, Like. I got out of high school, went to Cap College for the first semester.

Speaker 1:

I went to Cap College, crap College, it was called.

Speaker 2:

You know, I realized it wasn't for me and skiing was calling. And uh, winter of 1992, sorry end of 91, 1992, uh, moved up to whistler, lived on the couch, signed up for my apprenticeship with the german builder, uh, hans kogler. Oh, yes, yeah, and did uh four plus years apprenticing under him. Um, got a taste for it got some.

Speaker 1:

Really, what was his company's name? Uh, it was kogler enterprises.

Speaker 2:

okay, yeah, okay. So a high-end custom home builder in Whistler was really good for me from an experience standpoint. I love building, I love construction and getting the depth of the experience and training through the apprenticeship program I think is what set me off on my journey towards entrepreneurship and running a business. That was my foundational tool that helped me segue into the business side.

Speaker 1:

So when you were making those high-end homes to begin with, what were you doing most of the time in there? What was the focus of the work that we do with carpentry? Or is it like?

Speaker 2:

No, I'll take you through the whole story.

Speaker 1:

Because it's interesting, because it sets you on what you're kind of interested in and you might be interested in the project management part for all I know. But typically there's that kind of that artisan side of you that goes, you know, because I've seen so many other projects Like you have a multifamily low rise at Arbutus and 13th. Yeah, arbutus, like my friend, lives three houses in on 13th there, yeah.

Speaker 2:

Arbutus, like my friend, lives three houses in on 13th there. Yeah, that's an interesting building. That's a 20-unit concrete building. Yeah, yeah, so we got a number of those.

Speaker 1:

Usually those are wood-framed everywhere else in the city. Yeah, those are always wood-framed. That was an interesting approach.

Speaker 2:

I don't know if the economy is a scaler there for that construction method. Two townhouse projects, one in Richmond and one on West Oak. Nice steel concrete building in Squamish, purpose-built rental in North End. So with the apprenticeship program going back to that, it was just a good foundation I loved to build. But I was always interested in business, I see. And so after I got my ticket, mr moved back to North End where I'm from.

Speaker 1:

So what was the ticket?

Speaker 2:

Carpenter, Carpenter okay, I'm a Red Seal journeyman carpenter.

Speaker 2:

Oh there, it is Okay, good, and so I think what that did for me is when I started promoting myself as a sole proprietor, building decks and fences and kitchens and bathrooms. I was still a young man who was relatively wild at the time. And how would a homeowner have trust in a younger guy like myself that could do their renovation or addition? And when I could pull out my red seal and my carpentry ticket, it gave them. It's like a degree in carpentry, yeah. And so it gave the confidence to my beginning client base over a number of years, established some understanding of business and ultimately Warren and I who is my business partner but also family we're working together on, and that's when we decided to become partners in 2002.

Speaker 1:

And that's where the real journey of B-Pack actually began, so 2002, like wow, that's crazy, like 22 years you've been doing this.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, we're rolling into 23, 24, actually.

Speaker 1:

So I mean are you satisfied or have you surpassed your goals you had back then, when you were starting?

Speaker 2:

out. It's interesting you ask me that Am I satisfied? No, no, I'm really enjoying the journey I'm on right now and I'm enjoying the journey our entire team and organization's on, but no, I'm not satisfied. We want to keep on going Very driven, very focused. We've learned the hard way over time. We've learned the good way. We've learned through education. We've learned the good way. We've learned through education. We've learned through trials and tribulations and experience. But our goal is to continue to evolve as an organization. It's very well managed, very well run. It has strong leadership.

Speaker 1:

True, yeah, so we can talk about the leadership side of things, because I find that very interesting because I did, you know, I did a little bit of research. I mean these are pretty like fast and ripping through these. But I was and ripping through these, but I was looking through your values there that I saw you were posting you had on LinkedIn, which is kind of cool. It's people, passion, progress and trust. So let's just go through those for a minute. So the people side is tough.

Speaker 2:

It's the toughest and most important piece of our business.

Speaker 1:

Like it's just with. How do you? How do you align people's trajectory in their life with your business goals? Because that's the hardest.

Speaker 2:

That's a very good question. It depends on the people you're talking about. Is it the people that are trade-based, is it the people that are consultant-based or client-based, or a team?

Speaker 1:

I think specifically your team, because that's really from. I mean, you know, when you're hiring trades, I mean you do have a procurement process there and you can decide which cultures fit with how you do a project and which don't. But when it comes to people who work actually for your, on your payroll et cetera, that's where it's hard, because it's so direct and you find out pretty quick whether or not there's an alignment or not.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, really good question. So how do we ensure that we have alignment?

Speaker 1:

No, I mean, how do you? If people are one of the core values? Obviously it means that you have an emphasis on finding those right factors fits and then making sure that you're obviously respecting what people's hopes and dreams are and making that an alignment with the business somehow, which is hard to do.

Speaker 2:

It's very hard to do and, I'll be honest, it's a, it's a constantly a learning process and it's all about making progress and um, which is one of them? Yeah, and I'm not going to say that we've always had it right, but we're definitely evolving and making progress, which, which is a core value. I believe very strongly that you have to make progress every day, and if you're not focused on making progress, you're flat. But progress sometimes is not going to be some massive goal. It could be very small increments.

Speaker 2:

With regards to the people side of things, over time, we've learned on which resumes or which skill sets to focus on, which personality sets to focus on, what are people's own personal goals and their career goals and how do they align with us as an organization. Our goal and I've said it many times, especially in the last couple of years is to have an organization that is constantly helping develop people's careers and, in turn, it also helps develop their life outside of their own. Do we have it perfect? Do we have it nailed down? No, but are we constantly focused on it and making progress?

Speaker 1:

absolutely so, as you're interviewing, are you asking these questions, are they? Well, not you? I mean, are you hiring people or you have hiring managers?

Speaker 1:

no, we have, we have an hr manager, hr manager, yeah, yeah, but I mean, you probably set those, those in place, though, in terms of these are going to be some of the questions that are meaningful to you and your management group.

Speaker 1:

In terms of like, when I hire people for Sitemax, I'm the last interview because I want to know.

Speaker 1:

I don't want to hire, I don't want any jerks in my organization at all, like they're not going to work, they're going to get turned out and it's just not going to fly, because there will be a time where I'll be like I always have this, I always have this one, this, this one um situation that I was talking about is when and you'll see this often with people who are making business decisions on your behalf everything is a t-junction. You can, they know the right thing to do is to turn right. You can, they know the right thing to do is to turn right, but sometimes there's that lazy left, and what bugs me the most is not the fact they took the left sometimes, but the fact that they knew that the right was the right one and they went ah, screw it, and they go left. That it's that decision part that always gets me, and I was trying to find what is the value trait that I can weed out early. That is going to get me less of those people.

Speaker 2:

So interesting question. I believe in passion and I can tell people about passion very quickly or not. And at the end of the day, skill set you can learn and develop. Skill is something you actually learn. Work ethic is a skill that you learn. Passion is something that you either live with or you don't. Can you make yourself a passionate person? I believe if you try hard.

Speaker 1:

Some people are just not, though right, some people are just not. They're on a different frequency.

Speaker 2:

And I believe in surrounding myself with people that live with passion, because you're like that, I can tell I mean I never met you before.

Speaker 1:

Came up to the table here. I'm like that guy's high energy, he's passion. You can tell he's just into it, he's into everything. Yeah, that's how you are.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, pretty much yeah yeah, and I think I think we all, as business owners and leaders, we want to surround ourselves with like-minded individuals, people that are are going to think on the same wavelength and there's still obviously many amazing organizations that have different wavelengths. I I feel that VPAC survives on a wavelength of passion and energy and, honestly, ambition and tenacity, and to me, that's how we're going to grow our organization. We want to attract and retain highly educated, high caliber professionals, but also be aware that if you live with passion and you're someone that's motivated to work hard and learn and constantly grow and make progress as a core value, yeah, um, you don't necessarily have to have the education. You have to live with passion and have that desire to get better every single day. And if you have these, those key attributes, you're going to get there. You're absolutely going to get there. So if you want something bad enough, you're passionate about it and you're willing to work hard, you're going to get there.

Speaker 1:

It's interesting because before I did any of this construction tech stuff, I used to be in a totally different business.

Speaker 2:

Okay.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I was always in tech, but I used to do employer value propositions for big companies Okay, for, like, manulife and the cooperators, insurance companies, cineplex, ODN, harvey's restaurants and it was about what it means to work somewhere Right, which is very difficult for a lot of people. So what I find is that construction is going through its marketing and communication sophistication evolutions. It's still kind of rudimentary now and it's getting more and more and more and more advanced, and I see kind of like the way insurance was getting more advanced. So what's interesting is that people's identities and I've always said this is that people have their identity, especially men, I don't know. I don't want to say the M word, the M word Because we're not like these days, no, the.

Speaker 1:

There's a lot of pride in where someone works, yep, and it's part of that identity. So there's the I always call it the barbecue conversation. You'll know that when you go to a barbecue and you don't know a bunch of people. The second question is so, what do you do? And what people want is they want that credibility from the name, because it means something. It was a part of their identity that they didn't have to explain. They're just like okay, apple, google, tesla Ferrari V-Pack V-Pack, exactly. So what I find interesting is the meaning around. Where we work is kind of interesting. So I always know, for instance, that there are some companies that employ the model of look, we're not going to be like in your case. For instance, do you have the lifespan to become Ellis Don or PCL? I don't know, you might have very big ambitions, but the fact is is that that's a massive multi-generational company that's gotten to where it's gotten and it's it's like, yeah, way over there right yeah.

Speaker 1:

However, the question is is that, like I always say when we have people at sitemax, I go. I want to make sure that the time spent with my company is they look back, I go. You're not going to work here forever, but the time that you do work here, you're going to be glad that you did work here, because you became a better person. You. You became somebody who knows more things. You are more well-rounded than you were before you came in here. So do you employ that kind of thing? Obviously, everyone wants to keep a hold of everyone as long as possible.

Speaker 2:

Honestly, this business is hard and we're coming out of a crazy cycle of the three-year cycle of COVID supply chain, the great resignation, all these different things that happened, and that was a real eye-opener and a real learning experience for me as a leader. At the end of the day, people are going to move on and if we're truly a great organization which is our goal is how do we set everybody in the organization up for success, whether it's within VPAC or their next steps after VPAC? And we're still getting it. We're still figuring it out. Every time we're trying to get stronger and better, but if someone can move on from VPAC and elevate their lives because of the time they spent with us, we've done something right and absolutely do we employ that kind of thought process and methodology?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I want to make sure that if I've got a young group that comes in a male or female project manager and they're starting it as a PC and they can work their way up to an APM and then they can become a PM and as we're growing as an organization we can create senior management position, that's great If they choose to move on somewhere, provided they've taken something away and they've gained something. I feel as an organization we're honoring the people side of our business.

Speaker 1:

That's cool because really, like, I'm looking at all these four words and I know I'm milking these four words Do it. It's quite the conversation here, because what I find interesting here is that if you are truly passionate about your people, then you're going to do that kind of thing. Yeah, which is very true, and I also do like the. So the progress part. Can thing, which is very true, and I also do like the so the progress part. Can you just take me through that word and how that, how does that dovetail? Through? Progress is everything.

Speaker 2:

Well, I know it's everything, but how?

Speaker 1:

does it? How does it relative to what you guys do, and how do you deploy?

Speaker 2:

that. So, if you think about it Right now, if you're not making progress, you're flat right and some days your organization is going to make mountains of progress, massive, massive gains in progress, and other days your progress is going to be very minimal. But it's progress. And the way I see our four key words there, our core values, is everything starts with people and for our organization and the trades we work with, the clients we have and the consultants we work with, we want to make sure that our passion position is well aligned, because when you take really great people with good skill sets, good drive, maybe tried and tested in the field or highly educated, and they're passionate, you're going to make progress Right.

Speaker 2:

And with progress, what you develop is trust. Trust is the hardest thing to earn and it's the easiest thing to lose. It is and it's critical in our business, in any business, in our networks, is to have trust and to hang on to trust. And the way those four words connect are exactly as I shared them. I've had people ask me why do you have trust as the bottom word? Well, actually, if you look at the way the words are stacked, it's vertical. Trust is the foundational tool.

Speaker 1:

Right, people actually ask you that. Yeah, they're like why is it lower than?

Speaker 2:

I had Sanjeev in our boardroom looking at it. Why is? It's the most important thing, and it only comes from putting great people together that are passionate, that focus on developing progress and have progress. That's where the trust comes from, it's the foundation, and to get there, you need the great people with passion.

Speaker 1:

So the trust side of things is kind of hard to do because everybody starts off with great intentions on any project. So I always say that the minute the deal is signed on a project is when it changed, because it almost because it just can't control everything. You can't control the city, you can't control the weather, you can't control COVID Hello, yeah, it came in. There's so many, there's so many factors that can come in and change that.

Speaker 2:

That's going to change that end delivery date. That was the expected completion date. There's so many risks, or darts, or arrows or bullets being shot at projects all the time and you're literally dodging and taking them you go to. Trust is, I believe, and our entire organization believes, staying connected to our clients. And again, every client's different, every project's different. They all have different stories to tell every single one. Some are much more colorful than others, but I believe if we stay connected to the client and focus on the best interests of the entire project, even if things have strain or duress throughout the course, there's still a level of trust because you're always looking out for the project and the team's best interest. I think that the world out there that's focused on bottom line, bottom price, shortest schedule, lowest quality, that's not a world where VPAC belongs.

Speaker 1:

And that's cool.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, vpac belongs in a place where we can take this amazing team we've got and put them in front of a client to add value, to help shape a project, to tackle some of the biggest challenge construction can throw at us and to shape it in a way that's not all about bottom line, bottom price, shortest schedule, because, again, that's not us.

Speaker 1:

So, on the trust piece, do you often talk to your staff, et cetera and the stakeholders you have about the mirror of trust, which basically means do I trust myself? Because that's the hard part, because we can always say, do I trust this or do I trust that, and it's like a top-down thing. But sometimes you can look in the mirror and go do I trust myself in actually doing this? You're good at this, eh, this is good. These are good questions, because I find that very difficult too, because not everybody is always. Some people have good days, bad days, and being consistent is hard and that's part of that trust piece.

Speaker 1:

So maybe talk to that a little bit in terms of are you like that? Do you trust yourself all the time to be able to deploy this all the time?

Speaker 2:

Well, I mean, we this all the time? Well, I mean, we're human, right, we're human. We have emotions, we have families, we have businesses, our kids are at school, we've got to get, uh, hockey or to dance or all these different things in our lives. So, um, being 100 consistent all the time is is a challenge. We're again. We're human beings. Um, at the end of the day, if you come back to your core values and your guiding light, you'll refocus. If you get distracted, you look way, you'll zero back in on your own and never lose sight of it. So, yeah, no, I can look in the mirror and honestly say I believe strongly, I trust myself, I trust my integrity and I really believe clients see that that's pretty cool.

Speaker 1:

I mean, I can see that image of your people looking in the mirror seeing themselves with those words behind their head that's in the background. That would be a great image for you guys, by the way, Because it shows all the things that, yes, I can actually stand up as a person, do these things, work with passion, and I have this moral framework behind me.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, moral framework's very strong, right, I mean, that's a strong comment, I mean, and it's really important to have a moral framework. We don't want to work with people in our organization that are slightly slight, if that makes sense Slightly slight.

Speaker 1:

You know what I mean.

Speaker 2:

Like if it makes sense, like they're willing to make concessions to our own core values to meet their own personal needs.

Speaker 1:

Ah yeah, that's a great point and we really don't have room for that.

Speaker 2:

We have zero room for that in our organization and I really there is no one like that within our group. It goes back to your comment on people and attraction and retention. I believe in gut instinct when you meet someone. First impressions are huge and I don't do first interviews and I believe it's really important to empower a team to start making some of their own decisions and judgments, but when there's a major role being placed and hired in an organization, I need my gut to tell me how I feel about the individual and I'll be honest with you.

Speaker 1:

my gut is always correct, god doesn't that. That's really hard for your staff, though, because this is what I found. I found that, oh, james said no, but we all liked this person. I'm like, oh God, I hate that, because I agree with you. After years and years and years of your job has been assessing whether or not there's a risk with people or not, you've become a professional at that. How many people have you been in front of you, go, I'm going to make a business decision based on that person's character or what they've demonstrated in front of me. Within a very short period of time, you had to make a judgment call, so if you're like a Jedi master at that, and then your staff, who have maybe done that 10 times that's hard.

Speaker 2:

So you raised a good conversation point Jedi Master. No Cool to be a Jedi Master, but not there, ninja. The reality is go back to trust. So just because I might not agree with a particular candidate, I do trust my team to make the right decisions. Okay, and there's so many different personalities out there and different characters and skill sets and different demographics that are working within our industry, many different cultures um, there's an amazing base of people, especially vancouver, and experiences and education to draw upon. First impressions are important, my gut instinct important, but my gut is more going to grab onto. Does this person lack integrity? Are they telling the truth? Can I see through the BS? What I'm not relying on my gut for is to make final decisions. If my team is saying this is a great candidate, I absolutely have to trust them and empower them to make those decisions and help manage that process with them and not be that kind of final gavel.

Speaker 1:

Guillotine, gavel, guillotine. Yeah, you know what I mean Gavel Gavel, Not guillotine. It's how much place you're running? Yeah, no.

Speaker 2:

So you know, I think when we talk about gut instinct, I'm more talking about integrity and honesty and being able to look someone in the eyes. You can tell a lot, right, yeah, eyes you can tell a lot right, I'm looking at you in the eyes right now.

Speaker 1:

What do you mean?

Speaker 2:

So it's one of those things making those final decisions, I still want my team to make them, because they know what they want better than I do for their certain departments, and I don't want to micromanage. I actually want to get better at allowing my team members to manage.

Speaker 1:

That's pretty cool. You've done a great advertisement for recruiting, by the way.

Speaker 2:

Oh yeah, this is good, okay, great, this is great.

Speaker 1:

I mean, you're saying all the things that I think matter to people.

Speaker 2:

I don't want to just be saying the right things, though. I want to make sure we act that and we follow through with that and I'm not going to lie. Running organizations from the ground up, that's a carpenter right. There's a lot of learning lessons that you go through over 23 years. I still plan on making or having another 23 years of learning lessons and having a second and third generation organization. Going back to your question about an LSGON or a PCL is that that level on my radar? I'm not going to answer the question. I'm going to say that we're always focused on progress, and if we focus on progress, we're going to make amazing gains over the next 20 years of my career. And then the second and third generation of V-Pack.

Speaker 1:

What do you think of this event? Pretty crazy, right, I've got to be honest, I love it.

Speaker 2:

This is my first one, first podcast. Thank you very much, you're welcome. And Sanjeev, he's a very skilled individual and I love his personality and he pulled me into ICBA, just you know, less than a year ago, and I got out for breakfast with him and we talked about the organization, where it came from and where it is now, and I've been watching on social media and hearing and realizing, as an organization, we really need to be a part of this and when I walked through the front door I was like, holy, this is for real. This is a really good turnout. Icb is absolutely a great, great platform and one that VPAC wants to be a part of, support, engage in and just be a part of the family.

Speaker 1:

Well, this has been a pleasure, man, my pleasure, thank you. This is cool. I love the fact I got to. There's very rare situations that you sit down with somebody you've never spoken to before and you spend 25 minutes like getting into it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's pretty cool. Lots more we could get into.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's awesome. Well, this has been fantastic. Is there anything you want to say to anybody listening to this about VPAC and some of your goals, some of the things that they want to contact you?

Speaker 2:

No, I mean honestly, I think I'm just happy to be here and part of the group. As an organization, we're striving to always improve. We always make progress. We're really focusing on people and focusing on challenging unique projects and unique relationships. Not vanilla, but something we can really get behind and add value to.

Speaker 1:

That's awesome. Well, I wish you the best of luck and hopefully we can do this again. We got a podcast studio. We could talk about another topic.

Speaker 2:

I've enjoyed this for my first time. You're doing great. You got a good voice, so you're good, all right. Thank you very much. Right on, take care. I enjoyed this for my first time. You're doing great. You've got a good voice, so you're good, all right. Thank you very much. Great to meet you Right on.

Speaker 1:

Thanks, Ben, Take care. Well, that does it for another episode of the Site Visit. Thank you for listening. Be sure to stay connected with us by following our social accounts on Instagram and YouTube. You can also sign up for our monthly newsletter at sitemaxsystemscom slash the site visit, where you'll get industry insights, pro tips and everything you need to know about the site visit podcast and Sitemax, the job site and construction management tool of choice for thousands of contractors in North America and beyond. Sitemax is also the engine that powers this podcast. All right, let's get back to building.